Are Hybrids Really That Green? Jay Leno Thinks "Not So Much"
A few months ago I had a casual breakfast with the extremely nice, forward thinking and innovative guys from Spin-LA and we were discussing the state of the auto industry in light of the move to become more green. That conversation sparked a dialog with now many others about whether hybrid technology is in fact as exciting as some of us thought that it was a few years ago.
Unfortunately these moments where I think I am having a "dialog" are sometimes too challenging to hybrid fans and I have, erm, upset them on occasion. For example, practically every person who is referred in this article about hybrids retaining their value got cross with my questions about if their hybrid investments were actually worth the environmental impact that the manufacturing actually costs.
But I am not the only one, I swear! Jay Leno has done a at least a couple of interviews now about this very subject. Of course Jay, in his entire luckiness, is sitting on a mountain of investments other people call collector cars but the jest of his point is that many of these cars have less environmental impact thank current hybrid technologies because they are fuel efficient and their manufacturing impact has practically expired because they were made 40+ years ago.
There are all sorts of number out there that I am currently trying to sort through (statistics not being my forte) that indicate that based on the typical 3-year trade in mentality that most hybrid owner demographics practice, the production of a hybrid has more of a negative environmental impact than the typical Ford F-350 owner. These numbers are based on some of those magical numbers that constitute a carbon footprint profile and include the total number of BTUs needed to manufacture something. For example, a common hybrid on the market will take the equivalent of 1,000 gallons of gas before it has a low carbon impact. Ford's pickups stay on the road an amazing number of years and pass through many owners without costing the environment any additional manufacturing impact.
John McCain even believes that we need to "leapfrog" current hybrid trends. Can we scramble fast enough to get the prize or, in light of the auto manufacturers now finally realizing that they were lazy and need to do some great R&D now for cars that will likely not be in production until post-2011, should we just wait and hold on to the cars that we have?
Not many of us would consider driving a Model T around but we do have to question whether a new car is always a necessity. Sure, older cars break but in the current economic climate, is a car payment on top of negative environmental consequences always the best idea?
XOO,M
Michelle Naranjo
Stumble It!
Unfortunately these moments where I think I am having a "dialog" are sometimes too challenging to hybrid fans and I have, erm, upset them on occasion. For example, practically every person who is referred in this article about hybrids retaining their value got cross with my questions about if their hybrid investments were actually worth the environmental impact that the manufacturing actually costs.
But I am not the only one, I swear! Jay Leno has done a at least a couple of interviews now about this very subject. Of course Jay, in his entire luckiness, is sitting on a mountain of investments other people call collector cars but the jest of his point is that many of these cars have less environmental impact thank current hybrid technologies because they are fuel efficient and their manufacturing impact has practically expired because they were made 40+ years ago.
There are all sorts of number out there that I am currently trying to sort through (statistics not being my forte) that indicate that based on the typical 3-year trade in mentality that most hybrid owner demographics practice, the production of a hybrid has more of a negative environmental impact than the typical Ford F-350 owner. These numbers are based on some of those magical numbers that constitute a carbon footprint profile and include the total number of BTUs needed to manufacture something. For example, a common hybrid on the market will take the equivalent of 1,000 gallons of gas before it has a low carbon impact. Ford's pickups stay on the road an amazing number of years and pass through many owners without costing the environment any additional manufacturing impact.
John McCain even believes that we need to "leapfrog" current hybrid trends. Can we scramble fast enough to get the prize or, in light of the auto manufacturers now finally realizing that they were lazy and need to do some great R&D now for cars that will likely not be in production until post-2011, should we just wait and hold on to the cars that we have?
Not many of us would consider driving a Model T around but we do have to question whether a new car is always a necessity. Sure, older cars break but in the current economic climate, is a car payment on top of negative environmental consequences always the best idea?
XOO,M
Michelle Naranjo
Labels: collector cars, Hybrids, MotaGreen, Used Cars
Stumble It!
posted by Miss Mota Mouth@ 3:32 PM 10 Comments
10 Comments:
I think a lot of people are thinking economically right now. Gas is expensive. Why take on additional debt when their current car is just fine? The credit crunch in the housing market could play a role here as well.
But for me, my 2006 Scion is just fine. I expect it to give me several more years of reliable service. Plus I get nearly 25 mpg during my daily commute. Why get rid of a car that's paid for and take on a payment for a hybrid that may or may not help my bottom line? Besides, I hate the Prius. I think the Volt looks much better. But what I'm really waiting for is the banana-peel-powered flux capacitor!
I'd like to see more diesel cars in the US. I drive a fully loaded Dodge / Mercedes Sprinter for work and can get 25mpg. I did drive a 00 Dodge full size van with the same load and got 9mpg. My wife had a diesel Jetta that got 50mpg. I believe that is better than most hybrids. Diesels need fewer oil changes (van goes 15000 miles), are reliable and typically last longer than a gas engine. Europe has all kinds of diesels why can't we get some of those? Just my opinion.
I agree with you! The unfortunate thing is that we actually manufacture several wonderful diesel cars in the US but they are exported to the European market.
The issues really aren't that the manufacturers don't want to introduce them here- they would love the sales. The problem is American emission and safety standards that take so much research and development plus years of testing that the manufacturers are all just waiting and watching for one of them to make the leap. Until then, nothing will happen.
Its kind of like "If you jump off the cliff first, then I will" mentality.
*yawn* For the record, I got tired of your tweets when you insisted on regurgitating the discredited "Hummers More Green/Environmental than Prius?" article. And then went on to conclude that marketing is somehow "forcing" and "misleading" the public to buy hybrids.
I drive my hybrid almost every single day. If I'm not driving it, my hubby is. It was the best purchase we've made in the past 2.5 years. It was and is the right vehicle for us.
Jay Leno likes to collect cars but that doesn't make him someone I'd listen to on the financial realities of buying a hybrid. The man can buy any vehicle he wants and afford to insure it even if he doesn't drive it more than once every 6 mos/1 year. I don't make buying decisions based on that Jay Leno or other celebrities, or marketing departments, do or say. I listen to fellow consumers who've come before me and decide if I am more or less like them--if their needs are met by the product, odds are mine will be as well. If not, I wait for the right product to come along.
The strength of your blog is the engaging topics, the weakness is the lack of sources and citations. It's where we butt heads, a la the discredited "Hummers Greener than Prius" article. And your totally unsubstantiated "3-year trade in mentality that most hybrid owner demographics practice".
If that were true a heck of a lot more hybrids would be available as leases...even more money for the dealerships, that way.
ageekgal: Thanks for taking the time to go through the archives, find the article, read it and let me know how I bore you! :-)
Anonymous: And your sources that I am wrong? Didn't realize that I was butting heads with anyone I didn't know. Thanks for stopping by!
Obviously, you both sort of missed the point. This article are about an ongoing dialog about a specific topic and you both just contributed.
I didn't realize you didn't want comments on a public blog article. Silly me!
If you stopped reading at "yawn" then that might be the problem, BTW, on the comprehension gap between us.
I didn't stop reading at your yawn- just find that an interesting way to start a comment. Little aggressive.
I always appreciate your opinions so thanks for leaving the rest of the comment.
Didn't realize there was a comprehension issue but then, again, it is your right to be rude in public. Glad Mota could give you the platform.
Yawning is rude and aggressive? I'm awfully glad I didn't *guffaw* then, you might have thought I was declaring war.
This bit of sweet & loving discourse should be my model, then? "practically every person who is referred in this article about hybrids retaining their value got cross with my questions about if their hybrid investments were actually worth the environmental impact that the manufacturing actually costs." followed by link to the post you feature my URL unrelated to hybrids and my Twitter ID in.
I'm happy to help you get your word count up by including that paragraph.
In Miss Mota Mouth's defense I think she has done an admirable job of presenting both sides of an issue.
She's talked about how hybrids are retaining value which is a direct result of demand. But then she has also discussed the environmental impact of manufacturing. Not all car makers are Subaru; i.e., green manufacturers.
I'm not 'green' by any means but for me, she's just reinforced some opinions. As I said in my earlier comment, my car gets gas mileage I'm happy with and I don't intend on purchasing a hybrid anytime soon. But that's my personal preference. Most of us base purchases on our feelings, the information at hand and the opinions of others. Miss Mota Mouth is just playing a part in that process.
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